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the araby dream lives and will never die.

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Comments

  • Rat-ee-jiK#7094Rat-ee-jiK#7094 Registered Users Posts: 169
    edited July 22
    Xihu said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:




    Artjuh90 said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    If the material from GW just isn't there yet, that they might be still in the process of developing a new Araby, I can accept that, but that doesn't seem to be the reason.

    Because Araby was based on a rather dated and sterotyping view of the middle east.

    now yes yes you will now tell me all warhammer is based on sterotypes.

    Well let's be honest; as sad as it is - in the world we currently live in mocking the middle east (even in good hearted jest and with the best intentions of middle eastern players in mind) is not a good idea... I doubt GW or CA have any real drive to open that particular can of worms when there is plenty of other content to tackle.
    We're not in the early 2000's anymore. Araby is obviously inspired by the Arab World but it's also inspired by Near Eastern mythology and folklore, neither of which are controversial. Other games, books, and movies have been released since then and having Arabic inspired factions haven't stirred anything.
    SerPus said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    Why should they give a reason for that? They said that developing new races is a lot of work, and that looks like a good enough reason to not expect every minor races in Warhammer setting to be implemented in the game.
    Because Araby has a fan base and it is one of the older, established factions in the setting despite being a minor one. People aren't/weren't unreasonable in expecting a fully developed Araby from appearing in the game, especially with the Vampire Coast and Cathay.
    tell that to charlie hapdo and the insane people who blew themself up.
    main reason araby wont be touched
    But those were Islamic extremists. There’s a difference between being a Muslim and being Arab… wtf??

    did i say they are the same?
    no i did not, but the islamic extremist do respond on it.
    You implied it. Arabs should be in the game and in Palestine.
    nobody wants another Charlie hebdo incident though. CA, being sensible, are worried about suggestions an accusations of racism/islamophobia etc and don't want to risk the safety of their staff. That's what's really going on.

    So for the foreseeable future we can all forget about araby.
  • NyxilisNyxilis Registered Users Posts: 7,551
    Xihu said:

    Nyxilis said:

    Xihu said:

    Nyxilis said:

    Xihu said:

    Eh… seems racist to me man.

    No proof, no evidence, no actions stated to that effect, or anything else.

    Proof that shows they were only going to do 2 races in game 2. Only 1 slot for a minor race. Vampire Coast.

    But no, ****.

    Got it.
    It’s racist to exclude Arabs for being Arab.
    Yet, first off. They're not Araby. They're a quasi mix of arabic, egyptian, morrocan, persian, and turkish themes. Much like Kislev is not Russian but a quasi mix of its region.

    Second, you have zero proof that's the reason for the exclusion.

    CA has made multiple middle eastern DLC people. Go look up their freaking games. Oh just fine to publish it here just fine.

    You make literally no sense.
    What have Arabs done that make you not want them in the game??

    Name one thing.
    Whelp, reading comprehension is not your strong point. I want Araby in the game.

    You and the rest of the troll bait here are the ones saying otherwise or making up nonsense reasons for their disinclusion.
  • XihuXihu Registered Users Posts: 206
    Nyxilis said:

    Xihu said:

    Nyxilis said:

    Xihu said:

    Nyxilis said:

    Xihu said:

    Eh… seems racist to me man.

    No proof, no evidence, no actions stated to that effect, or anything else.

    Proof that shows they were only going to do 2 races in game 2. Only 1 slot for a minor race. Vampire Coast.

    But no, ****.

    Got it.
    It’s racist to exclude Arabs for being Arab.
    Yet, first off. They're not Araby. They're a quasi mix of arabic, egyptian, morrocan, persian, and turkish themes. Much like Kislev is not Russian but a quasi mix of its region.

    Second, you have zero proof that's the reason for the exclusion.

    CA has made multiple middle eastern DLC people. Go look up their freaking games. Oh just fine to publish it here just fine.

    You make literally no sense.
    What have Arabs done that make you not want them in the game??

    Name one thing.
    Whelp, reading comprehension is not your strong point. I want Araby in the game.

    You and the rest of the troll bait here are the ones saying otherwise or making up nonsense reasons for their disinclusion.
    I’ve seen multiple people in here make presumptions as to why Araby isn’t being included or flat out confusing the Islam religion with the Arab race, yet somehow I’m the one you claim is off base?

    Resorting to name-calling on top of that shows your character.


  • XihuXihu Registered Users Posts: 206

    Xihu said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:




    Artjuh90 said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    If the material from GW just isn't there yet, that they might be still in the process of developing a new Araby, I can accept that, but that doesn't seem to be the reason.

    Because Araby was based on a rather dated and sterotyping view of the middle east.

    now yes yes you will now tell me all warhammer is based on sterotypes.

    Well let's be honest; as sad as it is - in the world we currently live in mocking the middle east (even in good hearted jest and with the best intentions of middle eastern players in mind) is not a good idea... I doubt GW or CA have any real drive to open that particular can of worms when there is plenty of other content to tackle.
    We're not in the early 2000's anymore. Araby is obviously inspired by the Arab World but it's also inspired by Near Eastern mythology and folklore, neither of which are controversial. Other games, books, and movies have been released since then and having Arabic inspired factions haven't stirred anything.
    SerPus said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    Why should they give a reason for that? They said that developing new races is a lot of work, and that looks like a good enough reason to not expect every minor races in Warhammer setting to be implemented in the game.
    Because Araby has a fan base and it is one of the older, established factions in the setting despite being a minor one. People aren't/weren't unreasonable in expecting a fully developed Araby from appearing in the game, especially with the Vampire Coast and Cathay.
    tell that to charlie hapdo and the insane people who blew themself up.
    main reason araby wont be touched
    But those were Islamic extremists. There’s a difference between being a Muslim and being Arab… wtf??

    did i say they are the same?
    no i did not, but the islamic extremist do respond on it.
    You implied it. Arabs should be in the game and in Palestine.
    nobody wants another Charlie hebdo incident though. CA, being sensible, are worried about suggestions an accusations of racism/islamophobia etc and don't want to risk the safety of their staff. That's what's really going on.

    So for the foreseeable future we can all forget about araby.
    But what does Islamic extremism have to do with Araby?
  • PassthechipsPassthechips Registered Users Posts: 1,083
    Artjuh90 said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    If the material from GW just isn't there yet, that they might be still in the process of developing a new Araby, I can accept that, but that doesn't seem to be the reason.

    Because Araby was based on a rather dated and sterotyping view of the middle east.

    now yes yes you will now tell me all warhammer is based on sterotypes.

    Well let's be honest; as sad as it is - in the world we currently live in mocking the middle east (even in good hearted jest and with the best intentions of middle eastern players in mind) is not a good idea... I doubt GW or CA have any real drive to open that particular can of worms when there is plenty of other content to tackle.
    We're not in the early 2000's anymore. Araby is obviously inspired by the Arab World but it's also inspired by Near Eastern mythology and folklore, neither of which are controversial. Other games, books, and movies have been released since then and having Arabic inspired factions haven't stirred anything.
    SerPus said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    Why should they give a reason for that? They said that developing new races is a lot of work, and that looks like a good enough reason to not expect every minor races in Warhammer setting to be implemented in the game.
    Because Araby has a fan base and it is one of the older, established factions in the setting despite being a minor one. People aren't/weren't unreasonable in expecting a fully developed Araby from appearing in the game, especially with the Vampire Coast and Cathay.
    tell that to charlie hapdo and the insane people who blew themself up.
    main reason araby wont be touched
    Man, it truly wouldn’t be the internet without someone showing a gross lack of knowledge of an event. Thanks for doing your part.
  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,893
    Xihu said:

    Xihu said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:




    Artjuh90 said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    If the material from GW just isn't there yet, that they might be still in the process of developing a new Araby, I can accept that, but that doesn't seem to be the reason.

    Because Araby was based on a rather dated and sterotyping view of the middle east.

    now yes yes you will now tell me all warhammer is based on sterotypes.

    Well let's be honest; as sad as it is - in the world we currently live in mocking the middle east (even in good hearted jest and with the best intentions of middle eastern players in mind) is not a good idea... I doubt GW or CA have any real drive to open that particular can of worms when there is plenty of other content to tackle.
    We're not in the early 2000's anymore. Araby is obviously inspired by the Arab World but it's also inspired by Near Eastern mythology and folklore, neither of which are controversial. Other games, books, and movies have been released since then and having Arabic inspired factions haven't stirred anything.
    SerPus said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    Why should they give a reason for that? They said that developing new races is a lot of work, and that looks like a good enough reason to not expect every minor races in Warhammer setting to be implemented in the game.
    Because Araby has a fan base and it is one of the older, established factions in the setting despite being a minor one. People aren't/weren't unreasonable in expecting a fully developed Araby from appearing in the game, especially with the Vampire Coast and Cathay.
    tell that to charlie hapdo and the insane people who blew themself up.
    main reason araby wont be touched
    But those were Islamic extremists. There’s a difference between being a Muslim and being Arab… wtf??

    did i say they are the same?
    no i did not, but the islamic extremist do respond on it.
    You implied it. Arabs should be in the game and in Palestine.
    nobody wants another Charlie hebdo incident though. CA, being sensible, are worried about suggestions an accusations of racism/islamophobia etc and don't want to risk the safety of their staff. That's what's really going on.

    So for the foreseeable future we can all forget about araby.
    But what does Islamic extremism have to do with Araby?
    Literally nothing.

    Araby is not a Muslim faction or an Islam-inspired faction. You maybe see some references to a monotheistic religion relayed by prophets, but that can fit so many real life religions including Mormonism, Zoroastrianism, and Yahwehism.

    The idea that people don't want Araby because they're scared of "Muslim extremism" is just fearmongering and ignorance, because frankly most Muslims don't care about how a fictional, fantastical game taking notes from one of the most prolific works of Arabic literature in history depicts a pretend religion. Araby could also just as easily have a pantheon that maps onto what you have in the Old World with a Near-Eastern coating.
  • Artjuh90Artjuh90 Registered Users Posts: 1,697
    Xihu said:

    Xihu said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:




    Artjuh90 said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    If the material from GW just isn't there yet, that they might be still in the process of developing a new Araby, I can accept that, but that doesn't seem to be the reason.

    Because Araby was based on a rather dated and sterotyping view of the middle east.

    now yes yes you will now tell me all warhammer is based on sterotypes.

    Well let's be honest; as sad as it is - in the world we currently live in mocking the middle east (even in good hearted jest and with the best intentions of middle eastern players in mind) is not a good idea... I doubt GW or CA have any real drive to open that particular can of worms when there is plenty of other content to tackle.
    We're not in the early 2000's anymore. Araby is obviously inspired by the Arab World but it's also inspired by Near Eastern mythology and folklore, neither of which are controversial. Other games, books, and movies have been released since then and having Arabic inspired factions haven't stirred anything.
    SerPus said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    Why should they give a reason for that? They said that developing new races is a lot of work, and that looks like a good enough reason to not expect every minor races in Warhammer setting to be implemented in the game.
    Because Araby has a fan base and it is one of the older, established factions in the setting despite being a minor one. People aren't/weren't unreasonable in expecting a fully developed Araby from appearing in the game, especially with the Vampire Coast and Cathay.
    tell that to charlie hapdo and the insane people who blew themself up.
    main reason araby wont be touched
    But those were Islamic extremists. There’s a difference between being a Muslim and being Arab… wtf??

    did i say they are the same?
    no i did not, but the islamic extremist do respond on it.
    You implied it. Arabs should be in the game and in Palestine.
    nobody wants another Charlie hebdo incident though. CA, being sensible, are worried about suggestions an accusations of racism/islamophobia etc and don't want to risk the safety of their staff. That's what's really going on.

    So for the foreseeable future we can all forget about araby.
    But what does Islamic extremism have to do with Araby?
    I'm not sure if people are just flat out **** or genuine have lived in their basement for the last 20 years and don't know what the world is actually like
  • XihuXihu Registered Users Posts: 206

    Xihu said:

    Xihu said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:




    Artjuh90 said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    If the material from GW just isn't there yet, that they might be still in the process of developing a new Araby, I can accept that, but that doesn't seem to be the reason.

    Because Araby was based on a rather dated and sterotyping view of the middle east.

    now yes yes you will now tell me all warhammer is based on sterotypes.

    Well let's be honest; as sad as it is - in the world we currently live in mocking the middle east (even in good hearted jest and with the best intentions of middle eastern players in mind) is not a good idea... I doubt GW or CA have any real drive to open that particular can of worms when there is plenty of other content to tackle.
    We're not in the early 2000's anymore. Araby is obviously inspired by the Arab World but it's also inspired by Near Eastern mythology and folklore, neither of which are controversial. Other games, books, and movies have been released since then and having Arabic inspired factions haven't stirred anything.
    SerPus said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    Why should they give a reason for that? They said that developing new races is a lot of work, and that looks like a good enough reason to not expect every minor races in Warhammer setting to be implemented in the game.
    Because Araby has a fan base and it is one of the older, established factions in the setting despite being a minor one. People aren't/weren't unreasonable in expecting a fully developed Araby from appearing in the game, especially with the Vampire Coast and Cathay.
    tell that to charlie hapdo and the insane people who blew themself up.
    main reason araby wont be touched
    But those were Islamic extremists. There’s a difference between being a Muslim and being Arab… wtf??

    did i say they are the same?
    no i did not, but the islamic extremist do respond on it.
    You implied it. Arabs should be in the game and in Palestine.
    nobody wants another Charlie hebdo incident though. CA, being sensible, are worried about suggestions an accusations of racism/islamophobia etc and don't want to risk the safety of their staff. That's what's really going on.

    So for the foreseeable future we can all forget about araby.
    But what does Islamic extremism have to do with Araby?
    Literally nothing.

    Araby is not a Muslim faction or an Islam-inspired faction. You maybe see some references to a monotheistic religion relayed by prophets, but that can fit so many real life religions including Mormonism, Zoroastrianism, and Yahwehism.

    The idea that people don't want Araby because they're scared of "Muslim extremism" is just fearmongering and ignorance, because frankly most Muslims don't care about how a fictional, fantastical game taking notes from one of the most prolific works of Arabic literature in history depicts a pretend religion. Araby could also just as easily have a pantheon that maps onto what you have in the Old World with a Near-Eastern coating.
    This is spot on. Thank you for being logical and not racist.
  • XihuXihu Registered Users Posts: 206
    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:

    Xihu said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:




    Artjuh90 said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    If the material from GW just isn't there yet, that they might be still in the process of developing a new Araby, I can accept that, but that doesn't seem to be the reason.

    Because Araby was based on a rather dated and sterotyping view of the middle east.

    now yes yes you will now tell me all warhammer is based on sterotypes.

    Well let's be honest; as sad as it is - in the world we currently live in mocking the middle east (even in good hearted jest and with the best intentions of middle eastern players in mind) is not a good idea... I doubt GW or CA have any real drive to open that particular can of worms when there is plenty of other content to tackle.
    We're not in the early 2000's anymore. Araby is obviously inspired by the Arab World but it's also inspired by Near Eastern mythology and folklore, neither of which are controversial. Other games, books, and movies have been released since then and having Arabic inspired factions haven't stirred anything.
    SerPus said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    Why should they give a reason for that? They said that developing new races is a lot of work, and that looks like a good enough reason to not expect every minor races in Warhammer setting to be implemented in the game.
    Because Araby has a fan base and it is one of the older, established factions in the setting despite being a minor one. People aren't/weren't unreasonable in expecting a fully developed Araby from appearing in the game, especially with the Vampire Coast and Cathay.
    tell that to charlie hapdo and the insane people who blew themself up.
    main reason araby wont be touched
    But those were Islamic extremists. There’s a difference between being a Muslim and being Arab… wtf??

    did i say they are the same?
    no i did not, but the islamic extremist do respond on it.
    You implied it. Arabs should be in the game and in Palestine.
    nobody wants another Charlie hebdo incident though. CA, being sensible, are worried about suggestions an accusations of racism/islamophobia etc and don't want to risk the safety of their staff. That's what's really going on.

    So for the foreseeable future we can all forget about araby.
    But what does Islamic extremism have to do with Araby?
    I'm not sure if people are just flat out **** or genuine have lived in their basement for the last 20 years and don't know what the world is actually like
    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:

    Xihu said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Xihu said:




    Artjuh90 said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    If the material from GW just isn't there yet, that they might be still in the process of developing a new Araby, I can accept that, but that doesn't seem to be the reason.

    Because Araby was based on a rather dated and sterotyping view of the middle east.

    now yes yes you will now tell me all warhammer is based on sterotypes.

    Well let's be honest; as sad as it is - in the world we currently live in mocking the middle east (even in good hearted jest and with the best intentions of middle eastern players in mind) is not a good idea... I doubt GW or CA have any real drive to open that particular can of worms when there is plenty of other content to tackle.
    We're not in the early 2000's anymore. Araby is obviously inspired by the Arab World but it's also inspired by Near Eastern mythology and folklore, neither of which are controversial. Other games, books, and movies have been released since then and having Arabic inspired factions haven't stirred anything.
    SerPus said:

    Has CA ever gave a reason why Araby won't be included? Kislev and Cathay exist because of Return to the Old World, and I'm assuming Araby is going to have some part in the module.

    Why should they give a reason for that? They said that developing new races is a lot of work, and that looks like a good enough reason to not expect every minor races in Warhammer setting to be implemented in the game.
    Because Araby has a fan base and it is one of the older, established factions in the setting despite being a minor one. People aren't/weren't unreasonable in expecting a fully developed Araby from appearing in the game, especially with the Vampire Coast and Cathay.
    tell that to charlie hapdo and the insane people who blew themself up.
    main reason araby wont be touched
    But those were Islamic extremists. There’s a difference between being a Muslim and being Arab… wtf??

    did i say they are the same?
    no i did not, but the islamic extremist do respond on it.
    You implied it. Arabs should be in the game and in Palestine.
    nobody wants another Charlie hebdo incident though. CA, being sensible, are worried about suggestions an accusations of racism/islamophobia etc and don't want to risk the safety of their staff. That's what's really going on.

    So for the foreseeable future we can all forget about araby.
    But what does Islamic extremism have to do with Araby?
    I'm not sure if people are just flat out **** or genuine have lived in their basement for the last 20 years and don't know what the world is actually like
    I’m probably more in tune with it than you…
  • Rat-ee-jiK#7094Rat-ee-jiK#7094 Registered Users Posts: 169
    edited July 22
    "But what does Islamic extremism have to do with Araby?"

    What matters is that CA are afraid of extremist attacks, like we have seen in the UK and France. So no araby, unless the situation changes.

    You can ask CA why not yourself if you like, but that is the real reason I think.

  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,893
    Artjuh90 said:

    Nyxilis said:

    Xihu said:

    Nyxilis said:

    Xihu said:

    Eh… seems racist to me man.

    No proof, no evidence, no actions stated to that effect, or anything else.

    Proof that shows they were only going to do 2 races in game 2. Only 1 slot for a minor race. Vampire Coast.

    But no, ****.

    Got it.
    It’s racist to exclude Arabs for being Arab.
    Yet, first off. They're not Araby. They're a quasi mix of arabic, egyptian, morrocan, persian, and turkish themes. Much like Kislev is not Russian but a quasi mix of its region.

    Second, you have zero proof that's the reason for the exclusion.

    CA has made multiple middle eastern DLC people. Go look up their freaking games. Oh just fine to publish it here just fine.

    You make literally no sense.
    you are aware all the mentioned countris follow the kalifate and all fall under the arabic countries.
    and historic is different then a satire version of clearly a spinoff of the arabic culure which can be founded offended.
    not only you have the cancel culture now which you didn't had back then even its a 1% threath some rando extrimist reacts to it it is reason enough to not implement it.

    and then the map around there in ME it will be even more packed then the lustria bowl
    How can you say so many things so inaccurately and so brazenly and act as if no one's going to take issue with it?

    Slavs are not offended by Kislev, and it's religion is called the Great Orthodoxy.
    Chinese people aren't offended by Cathay, which arguably is more a satire of contemporary Communist China that Dynastic China.

    Arabs and Arabic Muslims aren't these delicate, easily-offended souls looking for reasons to get angry. So many games lets you play Arabic-inspired or historical Arabic factions and no one gets offended or circle-jerk over it. Plenty of Muslims play video games like Crusader Kings, Civilization, and the like and don't actually pick the Arabs or Persians, they pick the faction they find the funnest like 90% of all players.

    You're literally stereotyping hundreds of millions of people across several dozen countries, languages, political systems, and communities, and chalk this all up to "cancel culture". Thank you for probably getting this topic shut down for the most asinine of reasons.
  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,893

    "But what does Islamic extremism have to do with Araby?"

    What matters is that CA are afraid of extremist attacks, like we have seen in the UK and France. So no araby, unless the situation changes.

    You can ask CA why not yourself if you like, but that is the real reason I think.

    Araby has been a faction in the Warhammer setting for decades with army lists, lore, and characters. In all that time, no one decided to go religious extremist on GW over it.

    Again, I cannot stress this enough, Arabs don't care about a fantastical faction inspired by Arabic folklore, because it's make-believe. Arabs also didn't care about the Mamluks, Abbasids, Egyptians, and other factions being playable in Medieval Total War, because it was done accurately and in respect to history. Muslims only get offended when you do something that's obviously offensive. Not saying hurting people it is ever justified, but you're seriously reaching here.
  • Artjuh90Artjuh90 Registered Users Posts: 1,697
    Then if i'm so wrong about the araby part being to delicate for current day extremism to be produced. why don't we see any other fantasy setting touching it anymore?
    like prince of persia, a old well establised title although the last one did not do amazing the few before did amazing.
    many here call me short sighted and think i'm even being racist but this is not the case.
    djinns, camalriders, units on flying carpets and elephants are great and i would like to see them aswell. but the current state of the world and it's politics won't allow it.
    you can try to put your head in the sand and deny it but you think the corperate board of CA would allow such thing pass the board? then who is the delusinal one
  • XihuXihu Registered Users Posts: 206
    Artjuh90 said:


    you can try to put your head in the sand

    I see what you did there
  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,893
    Artjuh90 said:

    Then if i'm so wrong about the araby part being to delicate for current day extremism to be produced. why don't we see any other fantasy setting touching it anymore?
    like prince of persia, a old well establised title although the last one did not do amazing the few before did amazing.
    many here call me short sighted and think i'm even being racist but this is not the case.
    djinns, camalriders, units on flying carpets and elephants are great and i would like to see them aswell. but the current state of the world and it's politics won't allow it.
    you can try to put your head in the sand and deny it but you think the corperate board of CA would allow such thing pass the board? then who is the delusinal one

    A game that just released is basically Arabic steampunk city builder: Airborne Kingdom where one of your structures is a minaret and your main structure is essentially a madrassah.

    Then you have the Alim in Rise of Legends, Mount and Blade Warband 2 where one of its factions is just Hijazi Arabia, plus all the historical titles like Crusader Kings, Civilization, Age of Empires, Medieval Total War and Empire Total War where you can play as an Islamic Empire, warts and all with the slavery, patriarchy, and religious extremism. No one has gotten upset over it. In fact the biggest voices for more of these options usually tend to come from Turkish, Iranian, or Arabic player-bases who want some kind of representation in their hobbies.

    Not only is there a demand for most Near Eastern/Arabic options in a lot more games, it's never been anything people got mad over. The only time video games got controversial with Arabic culture was when a Modern Warfare game showed Arabic being spoken in Pakistan. That's literally it.
  • PassthechipsPassthechips Registered Users Posts: 1,083
    Artjuh90 said:

    Then if i'm so wrong about the araby part being to delicate for current day extremism to be produced. why don't we see any other fantasy setting touching it anymore?
    like prince of persia, a old well establised title although the last one did not do amazing the few before did amazing.
    many here call me short sighted and think i'm even being racist but this is not the case.
    djinns, camalriders, units on flying carpets and elephants are great and i would like to see them aswell. but the current state of the world and it's politics won't allow it.
    you can try to put your head in the sand and deny it but you think the corperate board of CA would allow such thing pass the board? then who is the delusinal one

    This is major yikes dude.

    I think you need to take a history class of the region and current events.

    To spell it out for you: Arab =/= Islam. The Charlie Hebdo tragedy happened due to a reaction of slanderous/pornographic content of the prophet Muhammad in which even regular depiction alone is haram. The perpetrators of the violence were responding to this specific action.

    There is nothing taboo/haram about representing Arabic historical elements that in many cases predate or are unrelated to Islam. Jinn (or in English djinnis) predate Islam!

    In fact there is nothing wrong with even representing Islam in video games. You can play as the Abassid Dynasty in AoE 4 (the third Islamic caliphate after Muhammad) or as Saladin in Civ 6 (an incredibly revered Islamic figure). Both of these are incredibly recent games!

    The problem with Araby was the caricatures they made of Legendary Lords with some coming as tropes directly from the Alladin movies (a terrible caricature of the region). If they were to do Araby they’d have to completely retcon a decent amount of characters, and I imagine they don’t want to dig that up.

    Educate yourself.
  • XxXScorpionXxX#2310XxXScorpionXxX#2310 Registered Users Posts: 5,922
    edited July 22
    as much as I'm not a fan of woke culture or tokenism i do think Araby could be a good way to include cultures and demographics that historically haven't seen themselves in the fantasy genre and do it in a way that doesn't cause resentment and respects lore.

    Just remove all reference to Islam and Ala. Give them a made up religion like how Bretonnia are based on Christians but follow the lady.
    Request scorched body textures, and fire death effects. At least 30% of all damage in this game comes from fire sources. Request Fire for the Fire God DLC.
  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,893

    as much as I'm not a fan of woke culture or tokenism i do think Araby could be a good way to include cultures and demographics that historically haven't seen themselves in the fantasy genre and do it in a way that doesn't cause resentment and respects lore.

    Just remove all reference to Islam and Ala. Give them a made up religion like how Bretonnia are based on Christians but follow the lady.

    I just want to play a faction that goes ham into Warhammer Total War's surprisingly robust economic and trade system. Imagine the High Elves with the slavery mechanic. You'd be the richest faction in the campaign with money to buy factions, armies, and mercenaries.

    Every RTS and Strategy game out there has that one mercantile faction that wins by making the most money, and Araby fits that slot perfectly, moreso than the High Elves or Dwarfs.
  • Rat-ee-jiK#7094Rat-ee-jiK#7094 Registered Users Posts: 169
    edited July 22

    Artjuh90 said:

    Then if i'm so wrong about the araby part being to delicate for current day extremism to be produced. why don't we see any other fantasy setting touching it anymore?
    like prince of persia, a old well establised title although the last one did not do amazing the few before did amazing.
    many here call me short sighted and think i'm even being racist but this is not the case.
    djinns, camalriders, units on flying carpets and elephants are great and i would like to see them aswell. but the current state of the world and it's politics won't allow it.
    you can try to put your head in the sand and deny it but you think the corperate board of CA would allow such thing pass the board? then who is the delusinal one

    A game that just released is basically Arabic steampunk city builder: Airborne Kingdom where one of your structures is a minaret and your main structure is essentially a madrassah.

    Then you have the Alim in Rise of Legends, Mount and Blade Warband 2 where one of its factions is just Hijazi Arabia, plus all the historical titles like Crusader Kings, Civilization, Age of Empires, Medieval Total War and Empire Total War where you can play as an Islamic Empire, warts and all with the slavery, patriarchy, and religious extremism. No one has gotten upset over it. In fact the biggest voices for more of these options usually tend to come from Turkish, Iranian, or Arabic player-bases who want some kind of representation in their hobbies.

    Not only is there a demand for most Near Eastern/Arabic options in a lot more games, it's never been anything people got mad over. The only time video games got controversial with Arabic culture was when a Modern Warfare game showed Arabic being spoken in Pakistan. That's literally it.
    Opinionated much? You claim to know how everyone in the arabic world thinks and feels? You'll ignore 9/11 and all the subsequent attacks because you want your favourite faction to be made ASAP. There is no getting around the geo-political situation. I played and enjoyed all the factions in Medieval TW 1+2, but the world has since changed. Ideally, this wouldn't be a problem at all but you haven't addressed the attacks on Charlie Hebdo in any way or other recent attacks. These attacks were supported by al-Qaeda, and it seems they had a role inthe organisation of the attack.
  • XihuXihu Registered Users Posts: 206
    edited July 22
    Bro, those attacks had nothing to do with Araby or Arabs in any way. Islam is a religion, Arab is a race, Araby is a fantastical country in Warhammer. How do you not get this?
  • PassthechipsPassthechips Registered Users Posts: 1,083
    @Xihu - CA isn’t excluding them based on race, and mischaracterizing that is bordering on trolling and a waste of everyone’s time.
  • XihuXihu Registered Users Posts: 206

    @Xihu - CA isn’t excluding them based on race, and mischaracterizing that is bordering on trolling and a waste of everyone’s time.

    Respectfully disagree.
  • Artjuh90Artjuh90 Registered Users Posts: 1,697
    edited July 22

    Artjuh90 said:

    Then if i'm so wrong about the araby part being to delicate for current day extremism to be produced. why don't we see any other fantasy setting touching it anymore?
    like prince of persia, a old well establised title although the last one did not do amazing the few before did amazing.
    many here call me short sighted and think i'm even being racist but this is not the case.
    djinns, camalriders, units on flying carpets and elephants are great and i would like to see them aswell. but the current state of the world and it's politics won't allow it.
    you can try to put your head in the sand and deny it but you think the corperate board of CA would allow such thing pass the board? then who is the delusinal one

    This is major yikes dude.

    I think you need to take a history class of the region and current events.

    To spell it out for you: Arab =/= Islam. The Charlie Hebdo tragedy happened due to a reaction of slanderous/pornographic content of the prophet Muhammad in which even regular depiction alone is haram. The perpetrators of the violence were responding to this specific action.

    There is nothing taboo/haram about representing Arabic historical elements that in many cases predate or are unrelated to Islam. Jinn (or in English djinnis) predate Islam!

    In fact there is nothing wrong with even representing Islam in video games. You can play as the Abassid Dynasty in AoE 4 (the third Islamic caliphate after Muhammad) or as Saladin in Civ 6 (an incredibly revered Islamic figure). Both of these are incredibly recent games!

    The problem with Araby was the caricatures they made of Legendary Lords with some coming as tropes directly from the Alladin movies (a terrible caricature of the region). If they were to do Araby they’d have to completely retcon a decent amount of characters, and I imagine they don’t want to dig that up.

    Educate yourself.
    Ye and it's not like the empire has many tropes that come from the katholic church. nor does brettonia right?
    yes they are build upon france and germany but you see also the religieon that was in thispart of the culture is depicted in their culture aswell. yes they are not the same but they drip into each other

    and clearly CA agrees cause time and time again they say staight up NO against araby.
    so who is wrong here? the zealots that get proven wrong in practice or the one explaining why it ain't happinging as is the truth
  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,893

    Artjuh90 said:

    Then if i'm so wrong about the araby part being to delicate for current day extremism to be produced. why don't we see any other fantasy setting touching it anymore?
    like prince of persia, a old well establised title although the last one did not do amazing the few before did amazing.
    many here call me short sighted and think i'm even being racist but this is not the case.
    djinns, camalriders, units on flying carpets and elephants are great and i would like to see them aswell. but the current state of the world and it's politics won't allow it.
    you can try to put your head in the sand and deny it but you think the corperate board of CA would allow such thing pass the board? then who is the delusinal one

    A game that just released is basically Arabic steampunk city builder: Airborne Kingdom where one of your structures is a minaret and your main structure is essentially a madrassah.

    Then you have the Alim in Rise of Legends, Mount and Blade Warband 2 where one of its factions is just Hijazi Arabia, plus all the historical titles like Crusader Kings, Civilization, Age of Empires, Medieval Total War and Empire Total War where you can play as an Islamic Empire, warts and all with the slavery, patriarchy, and religious extremism. No one has gotten upset over it. In fact the biggest voices for more of these options usually tend to come from Turkish, Iranian, or Arabic player-bases who want some kind of representation in their hobbies.

    Not only is there a demand for most Near Eastern/Arabic options in a lot more games, it's never been anything people got mad over. The only time video games got controversial with Arabic culture was when a Modern Warfare game showed Arabic being spoken in Pakistan. That's literally it.
    Opinionated much? You claim to know how everyone in the arabic world thinks and feels? You'll ignore 9/11 and all the subsequent attacks because you want your favourite faction to be made ASAP. There is no getting around the geo-political situation. I played and enjoyed all the factions in Medieval TW 1+2, but the world has since changed. Ideally, this wouldn't be a problem at all but you haven't addressed the attacks on Charlie Hebdo in any way or other recent attacks. These attacks were supported by al-Qaeda, and it seems they had a role inthe organisation of the attack.
    Araby is older than 9/11. It's also the invention of a British company, not Americans and so not colored by American politics. While there are obvious similarities, how Arabs and Muslims are treated in the UK is a bit different considering the whole "We used to run the entire Near East and Indian sub-continent and so some of the oldest mosques in all of Europe outside of Spain are in Great Britain."

    You are projecting a tiny window of American history over a fictional fantasy faction that's been around since the 80's. Speaking as an American myself, stop using our hang-ups with certain cultures and religions in places where it just doesn't belong.

    People could play as the very Arabic-coded Redguards in all the Elder Scrolls games, watch the two different versions of Aladdin where Allah is referenced to directly in the original, or in any historical Medieval video game, including the majority of CA's own line-up. No one Arabic or Muslim got upset that you can play as the Mamluks or Ottomans, and no one who's ever lived under Islamic rule got upset that they are a playable option.

    The world, even the gaming world, is bigger than the USA and its weird issues. Stop pretending otherwise.
  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,893

    @Xihu - CA isn’t excluding them based on race, and mischaracterizing that is bordering on trolling and a waste of everyone’s time.

    I was really hoping people would stop doing this so we could actually talk about the faction, but maybe xenophobia is the actual reason, but at least it's not from CA or GW, but from a needlessly loud subsect of the player base.
  • PassthechipsPassthechips Registered Users Posts: 1,083
    Artjuh90 said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Then if i'm so wrong about the araby part being to delicate for current day extremism to be produced. why don't we see any other fantasy setting touching it anymore?
    like prince of persia, a old well establised title although the last one did not do amazing the few before did amazing.
    many here call me short sighted and think i'm even being racist but this is not the case.
    djinns, camalriders, units on flying carpets and elephants are great and i would like to see them aswell. but the current state of the world and it's politics won't allow it.
    you can try to put your head in the sand and deny it but you think the corperate board of CA would allow such thing pass the board? then who is the delusinal one

    This is major yikes dude.

    I think you need to take a history class of the region and current events.

    To spell it out for you: Arab =/= Islam. The Charlie Hebdo tragedy happened due to a reaction of slanderous/pornographic content of the prophet Muhammad in which even regular depiction alone is haram. The perpetrators of the violence were responding to this specific action.

    There is nothing taboo/haram about representing Arabic historical elements that in many cases predate or are unrelated to Islam. Jinn (or in English djinnis) predate Islam!

    In fact there is nothing wrong with even representing Islam in video games. You can play as the Abassid Dynasty in AoE 4 (the third Islamic caliphate after Muhammad) or as Saladin in Civ 6 (an incredibly revered Islamic figure). Both of these are incredibly recent games!

    The problem with Araby was the caricatures they made of Legendary Lords with some coming as tropes directly from the Alladin movies (a terrible caricature of the region). If they were to do Araby they’d have to completely retcon a decent amount of characters, and I imagine they don’t want to dig that up.

    Educate yourself.
    Ye and it's not like the empire has many tropes that come from the katholic church. nor does brettonia right?
    yes they are build upon france and germany but you see also the religieon that was in thispart of the culture is depicted in their culture aswell. yes they are not the same but they drip into each other

    and clearly CA agrees cause time and time again they say staight up NO against araby.
    so who is wrong here? the zealots that get proven wrong in practice or the one explaining why it ain't happinging as is the truth
    This is not a good argument. You are assuming with absolutely no proof to your case. CA/GW have never elaborated why they do not want to add these races. Everything we have said is based on our conjecture alone.

    CA have also said they have no plans of doing Eastern races like Ind or Nippon (which was even excluded from the IE map). Based on your logic they are being racist to people from India and Japan. It does not take much brainpower to know this is wrong.

    CA clearly has had no problems representing Araby the location or Arabic sounding places in the game. They even mention Araby in some event text. It’s also highly possible that Araby units show up in the Dogs of War roster.
  • talonn#7575talonn#7575 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 2,825
    Mod is sleeping I guess
  • SaintCorn#3148SaintCorn#3148 Registered Users Posts: 2,846
    Ah, an Araby discussion.
    They always start with Araby is dead and give up already.

    Then, they always end with a bunch of people yelling about how Araby didn't come in because of racism, xenophobia, and so on and so forth with no evidence to back it up.

  • Mr_Finley7#4571Mr_Finley7#4571 Junior Member Registered Users Posts: 8,375

    @Xihu - CA isn’t excluding them based on race, and mischaracterizing that is bordering on trolling and a waste of everyone’s time.

    I was really hoping people would stop doing this so we could actually talk about the faction, but maybe xenophobia is the actual reason, but at least it's not from CA or GW, but from a needlessly loud subsect of the player base.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if it was the eye wateringly ignorant reactions from the community that have convinced CA doing Araby isn’t worth it.

    People are just too dumb to press pause on their bigoted ideologies long enough to play a video game

  • NemoTheElf101NemoTheElf101 Registered Users Posts: 2,893
    Artjuh90 said:

    Artjuh90 said:

    Then if i'm so wrong about the araby part being to delicate for current day extremism to be produced. why don't we see any other fantasy setting touching it anymore?
    like prince of persia, a old well establised title although the last one did not do amazing the few before did amazing.
    many here call me short sighted and think i'm even being racist but this is not the case.
    djinns, camalriders, units on flying carpets and elephants are great and i would like to see them aswell. but the current state of the world and it's politics won't allow it.
    you can try to put your head in the sand and deny it but you think the corperate board of CA would allow such thing pass the board? then who is the delusinal one

    This is major yikes dude.

    I think you need to take a history class of the region and current events.

    To spell it out for you: Arab =/= Islam. The Charlie Hebdo tragedy happened due to a reaction of slanderous/pornographic content of the prophet Muhammad in which even regular depiction alone is haram. The perpetrators of the violence were responding to this specific action.

    There is nothing taboo/haram about representing Arabic historical elements that in many cases predate or are unrelated to Islam. Jinn (or in English djinnis) predate Islam!

    In fact there is nothing wrong with even representing Islam in video games. You can play as the Abassid Dynasty in AoE 4 (the third Islamic caliphate after Muhammad) or as Saladin in Civ 6 (an incredibly revered Islamic figure). Both of these are incredibly recent games!

    The problem with Araby was the caricatures they made of Legendary Lords with some coming as tropes directly from the Alladin movies (a terrible caricature of the region). If they were to do Araby they’d have to completely retcon a decent amount of characters, and I imagine they don’t want to dig that up.

    Educate yourself.
    Ye and it's not like the empire has many tropes that come from the katholic church. nor does brettonia right?
    yes they are build upon france and germany but you see also the religieon that was in thispart of the culture is depicted in their culture aswell. yes they are not the same but they drip into each other

    and clearly CA agrees cause time and time again they say staight up NO against araby.
    so who is wrong here? the zealots that get proven wrong in practice or the one explaining why it ain't happinging as is the truth
    In all my times I've gone to mass, I've never seen a statue or a stained-glass depiction of a big, burly, Conan-looking guy with a massive warhammer holding up an Ork's head. I don't remember seeing massive bears in Liturgy either.
This discussion has been closed.